Tagged: Interstitial cystitis
- ftderParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 5:05 pmPost count: 210
If you have not been eating rice or fruit, it is likely (?) that you are consuming minimal carbs which would yes put you into a fat-burning state (yes, ketosis). This is NOT necessarily a bad thing (although the research on the effects of ketosis and intermittent fasting is skewed heavily towards men). I am not really sure it is a bad thing? Except that for people with chronic health conditions, it may add additional stress to the body? And then there are those hard core anti-grain and starch folks that think being in ketosis is the ONLY way to regain health? Paul Jaminet from the Perfect Health diet seems to be an advocate of limited carb diet, rather than ketosis. He recommends I think consuming at least 200 calories from carbs per day, but I am not sure.
I may try the ketone strips, but I have also read they are not very reliable. I just don’t want ketosis to affect my sleep! (I have good sleep! At least I have THAT going for me, LOL, and I dont want to mess with that!). I have read ketosis can cause sleep problems, especially for women, as well as hormone changes that are not as suitable to women as to men. Similar goes for intermittent fasting (eating, say, only between the hours of 11 and 6).PamParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 7:19 pmPost count: 52
I think I read on WebMD that you need at least 100 calories from carbs per day, I suppose there are conflicting requirements. I also read on Livestrong that ketosis can help with sleep so I am confused.
My sleep in a nutshell sucks! Always has but it may be from having three kids and breastfeeding all the time. Also, the IC got me up sometimes 6 times per nite.
Right now I get up at least 2 times per nite. We have tried everything under the sun and I cannot sleep. I get up, pee, drink a cup of water cause I am so thirsty at nite and then I fall right back to sleep.
PamftderParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 7:47 pmPost count: 210
Pam, I think my holistic doctor could get you sleeping through the night and help fill in some of your IC-healing gaps. She did it for me. Let me know if you want more info. Do you think with your thirst and low carb diet that maybe you need more water during the day, and less at night? Wondering about this. I am sleeping like a kid again! 🙂ftderParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 7:52 pmPost count: 210
Pam, also from what I have been reading, ketosis can have a VERY different effect on women than men because our hormones and metabolism are different. Most of the keto studies have been done on mostly men. Anecdotal reporting says ketosis will effect a woman’s hormones, sleep, and metabolism in potentially a detrimental way, but I am sure this is not true for everyone. Wonder if you were a glucose burner if you would not wake up at night as much (even if you had to pee, maybe you would sleep through it). Is it chicken or the egg? 🙂PamParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 8:14 pmPost count: 52
Well I have been thru plenty of holistic healing practioneers and many with emphasis on IC so we are talking that I have been dealing with this for over 10 years so you could imagine…I’ve been thru it all.
Many have tried to help with the sleeping issue and some think it may be psychological because I have had this problem for a long time.
I am sure I went into ketosis because I had lost a lot of weight initially and I am keeping it off. Mainly belly fat that I could not get rid of. And when I look at the ketosis symptoms I had a lot of them.
Also, could be hormones as I had everything taken out two years ago. I am on bioidenticals and they help even out the problems.
I am still healing I do believe as I can actually function but still not completely healed. Not sure how bad your case was but if you were not getting up thru the nite to pee then I am wondering if you had IC or something else. Mine was so bad that during tests that I was actually flying off of the table.
PamftderParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 8:48 pmPost count: 210
Arg, Pam, I hear you! I have been dealing with what I think is IC for 2 years and that feels like forever! I think it is IC, as I had to pee a lot during the day and at my worst, in the first year, had urge feelings even when my bladder was empty. From talking to other IC sufferers, some seem to have to pee at night and some not? Gee, haha, it would be nice to think I did not have IC, but I think I do, but it is on the milder end of things. As you know I wish you continued healing!!! I think you are on a good path now!!PamParticipantDecember 3, 2014 at 10:27 pmPost count: 52
Thanks to you too for the support and joining this forum it is really fantastic isn’t it.
With your overactive bladder they may have said you had IC but not knowing what your health history is…they may think it could be caused by perimenopause as decreased estrogen effects the bladder and urethera and then blown you off and said overactive bladder, gave you that med which would have increased constipation and made your problem even worse!
I went through all the testing, the scoping, everything. To be quite honest, I think IC is really just the result of something else. I used to pee…. alot and the burning paining was incredibly awful…to think some women pee up to 30 or 60 times per day and still blindly believe 100% in their doctors. These poor women, and children, and even men that have this.
PamftderParticipantDecember 4, 2014 at 2:49 pmPost count: 210
Pam, yes the whole process of diagnosis in the west is rediculous. The state of diagnosis and treatment is abysmal. I can’t believe I subjected myself to cystoscopy. I never ended up taking any western medication I just went straight to my holistic doctor. IC does not need cystoscopy for diagnosis. I diagnosed myself after 6 weeks of UTI-like symptoms, in the absense of a positive test for bacteria in my urine. So I knew it was not a UTI, but inflammation. Since that time, things calmed down significantly.
IC is a disease of the small intestine, not really the bladder per say. The bladder just takes the brunt of the inflammation and makes life so much harder. In my doctor’s dissertation on IC, she notes that MANY of her patients had significant life events preventing proper maternal bonding. This description fits me exactly and was haunting and fascinating to read about! So we may have been born with a weak bladder/kidney meridian or other predisposing organ system weaknesses as described in Classical Chinese Medicine, but then for many of us, early life events sent us up for undo childhood stress, leading to IBS with underlying impaired intestinal motility (likely from chronic, low grade stress). This sets the stage for disbyosis. Add to this exposure to antibitotics and Norm’s observation of excessive carbs in the SAD diet which feeds the SIBO (chemical birth control use and NSAIDS later on, etc..sinus medications, steriods, pregnancy, allergy medicaitons, vegetarian diet, mis-use of “natural” supplements, the list goes on!) and the problems start to accumulate in the GI.PamParticipantDecember 4, 2014 at 3:30 pmPost count: 52
You bring good insights to the table and you are so smart to see a holistic Dr. right away. I went thru all the painful tests I had no idea what was going on.
I am sure stress played a huge part as I had an extremely stressful childhood. My mom also consumed a very nasty drug, DES, while prego with me cause she kept losing babies. This is one of the reasons I wanted a full hysterectomy. The only way I really narrowed it down was I only had two parts left bladder and bowel and things were still messed up so I knew it had to be one part or the other.
Also, I am a military brat and so I was born in Germany in the late l950’s and contracted this diarrhea epidemic that was going around as an infant and was in a incubator for some time. Lost my dad to cancer not to long after that and my mom was very sick with heart disease so she was never healthy and I suspect she also had SIBO given that her gut was so large and she only weighs about 115 pounds. My poor mom, clueless about this.
Whats more bothersome is my sister is going down the same road with other bad autoimmune stuff too! She will not listen to anything I tell her! She is going thru a private hell right now she went thru the bladder mesh surgery and it has degraded in her body and now has had multiple other surgerys to fix this. Her bladder is TOAST. And she is a part of the multimillion dollar lawsuit.ftderParticipantDecember 4, 2014 at 4:48 pmPost count: 210
Pam, thanks! It is so hard to see family members sick and feel powerless to help them. My sister also has her share of health problems and does not heed any of my advice, really. The same holds true of my parents, althuogh I did get my dad to cut way back on sugar.
Exposure to drugs in utero is one of the many things that sets us up for chronic illness as an adult. As does the nutritional status/health/microbiome of our mother and father that are passing down DNA and in the case of the mother, microbes! We start out with a deficit of healthy flora and then have to try to build our health from there and that is a tall order! Another part of my health picture is that I took some fertility drugs to concieve my first child (not IVF, but other drugs). My holistic doc said this played a role in my developing IC. But I was developing it before the fertility drugs also, because I had painfull periods (common, but not normal), endometriosis, and sub-fertility. So many different health pictures can lead to IC, that is why my doc does not use a one size fits all for treatment.PamParticipantDecember 4, 2014 at 9:48 pmPost count: 52
Did you ever resolve the endometriosis? This is what my daughters doctor suspects she has but after I read Dr. Pimentals book (IBS/SIBO) he recommended that anyone that has endometriosis or any other chronic pelvic pain be tested for SIBO. So, my 22 year old daughter got the breath test and her SIBO is 2 times worse than mine, we are treating for that. She just got back from the gastro checking via colonoscopy and endoscopy and they did a bunch of biopsies but they did not see any endometriosis there so really would like to hear your story and if you got that resolved without doing this explorative surgery for endo.
PamJaemeParticipantDecember 5, 2014 at 3:59 amPost count: 348
Bearsmom- will try to catch up on your questions:
1.) First breads that worked for me were baguette, English muffin, light rye & naan. Check ingredients, as brands can differ. Also watch portions- only a half muffin, half slice of bread, 1-2″ long piece of baguette, etc.
2.) Yes, I had relapses off and on the first month or two- so much rebalancing going on in the gut while it heals.
3.) YES, ketosis kept me in high gear and I barely slept two hours a night despite sleep aids like melatonin (prior to ketosis I slept like a baby). I eventually went on a Rx (which I normally shun like the plague) called Remeron (suggested by another forum member). At very low dose it acts as an antihistamine for sleep and has a healing effect on the digestive system. Worked like a charm, and getting good sleep also facilitated healing.
4.) My carbs still come mostly from fruits, veggies & dairy (& chocolate). I feel better staying mostly away from grains & beans.ftderParticipantDecember 5, 2014 at 5:47 amPost count: 210
Jaeme, GREAT to hear from you, thanks!!! How do you figure how much chocolate is reasonable? Do you stick with milk choc. since the dark has so much fiber? I am going to only cut rice for 5-7 days so I hope I dont really go into ketosis, I would really rather not. I still have some lingering gas (minor) and burping (pretty minor) and a tiny trace of heartburn in the afternoon (which in general is kind of rare for me so I wonder if things are shifting). I was going to cut the rice to get my FP super low for a week. Also I keep using too much magnesium and I think that might be creating the gas so I am going to try to cut that out for a few days. My only other concern in dairy but I am having very small amounts of that so I am hoping it is ok. I adore my greek yogurt. THANKS for your thoughts and for checking in. It means a LOT!ftderParticipantDecember 5, 2014 at 7:53 pmPost count: 210
Pam, the answer to your question regarding Endo is a long one. Firstly, without wanting to alarm you, your daughter is at risk for IC with her Endo symptoms. Does having endo mean she will get IC? No. But they are closely related. And to some extent she inherited your gut flora (via placenta and if you had a vaginal birth, via delivery through the vaginal canal). Many women by childbearing age have very disrupted gut flora that sadly we hand down to our children. If she took any antibiotics or other medications as a child that puts her at further risk.
I hope she will look at Norm’s diet and keep track of her lifestyle/behavior choices (keeping stress low, eating whole foods, limiting sugar and alchohol, recreational and over the counter drugs and ESPECIALLY antibiotics) as this will all help lower her risks.
I had laproscopy to fix a septate (misshapen) uterus to prevent future miscarriage. At that time they found Stage 2 Endo (whatever that means–ah, the Western classification of disease is mostly annoying to me these days, now that I treat with a Chinese Medicine Doctor). They lasered what they could find, but that does not mean they got everything. In chinese medicine, they explain conditions called latency and compensation. You can read about it in Dr. Brizman’s dissertation. It will give you a better sense of what is going on in the body when one has something like endometriosis, fibroids, skin tags, and other growths. Below is an interesting but dense article explaining the complex process of latency (disease process) in the body. http://www.acupuncturetoday.com/mpacms/at/article.php?id=32470.
The classical chinese medicine view is that the body does very strange things to manage pathogens and exposure to toxins in the body. Endo being one of them.
So if she treats the endo with surgery, it may return, as the underlying issues have not been addressed that allowed the endo to occur in the first place. This could include managing SIBO, and other variables that contribute to disease (chemical birth control and antibiotics and NSAIDS are some big ones that come to mind). I would always advocate, like Norm does, dietary and lifestyle/behaviour modifications over something invasive like surgery. I also feel VERY strongly that abx treatment for SIBO is not necessary and the down sides are not good. My holistic doctor would agree. Addressing the underlying contributors to SIBO is much more crticial. And Norm’s diet. I know you and I may not agree on this. I have seen no upsides to useing the ABX therapy in any of the case studies I read (except for yours, but you are following Norm’s diet, so that kind of skews the results 😉
Anyway, I hope that answers some of your questions and interesting and now not surprising at all to read of the connection btw. SIBO and endo. I have had SIBO for my whole adult life, and endo along with it. I am lucky that after chinese medicine treatment in my 20s (and now again in my 40s) I have really no endo pain to speak of and no painfull periods.
All the best to your daughter!! xo
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